If only it was that simple!!!!! ............. as just bending some pipes etc etc......if it was then surely you could be making your own headers with your engineering background & selling your quality product to your fellow forum members at a great price?? There have been many factors delaying this 2nd round GB!! All the GB participants have been more than made aware of what has been going on via PM's!.......but seeing as you want to drag this into the public forum to send your 'warning' to other members!!! ............then here is a brief summary of just the main points so that EVERYONE can have a read & make up their own mind!!! 1. We needed a MINIMUM of 6 buyers to make this GB happen again as the old manufacturer would not produce single items! This took at least 2 months or more to find genuine buyers who were prepared to pay a deposit!! 2. During this time a few things were brought to TTZ's attention regarding some quality control issues on the 1st round GB batch! This added to Simon's disappointment in other business related matters involving the supplier so he decided to find a new one.......which wasn't just a matter of a yellow pages phone call!!! He had to find a supplier who had proven quality control but who would still be prepared to take such a relatively small order AND keep the costs the same as before!!!! It's not like there is a demand for hundreds of Z32 NA headers to be made each year!!.....so many manufacturers would not be interested in this work! If we could have just made another batch of 6 with the old manufacturer this GB would have been finished long long ago! 3. Then once the decision had been made & a new manufacturer sourced!............the old manufacturer would not release the original jigs which technically belong to TTZ........so rather than go through a lengthy legal battle Simon decided just to pay for new jigs to be made!.......at TTZ's expense!!......... & they were not cheap!! 4. Spending $ to make new jigs meant there was an opportunity to consider possible design changes??.......to see if any improvements were worth considering! Simon & the new manufacturer's looked into possibilities relating to the EGR provision and the never ending debate about 'tuned length' etc......but after lengthy deliberation & cost analysis the manufacturer suggested the original design was still the most cost effective option with PROVEN results to back it up! Any changes could have possibly resulted in less gains as there was no budget for extensive testing to ensure any new changes were worthwhile! 5. Once the new jigs were made the mandrel bending machines could be programmed. The laser cut flanges were outsourced......... as they don't do this onsite!........& a 'prototype' had to be made for approval & quality checks by TTZ! So this is where we are at!......the prototype should be at TTZ for approval this week! then it shouldn't be too far away from completing the GB!.......... FINALLY!! So all this has happened which you have been briefed on!!....... yet you suggest this GB has been nothing but a 'root around' & that nothing is being done??? & that myself & TTZ are just out to rip you off!! Can I ask you this??........considering all of the above....... a 'root around' for who?????? To be honest my patience is starting to wear thin with some of the attitude & accusations I'm copping lately! The only reason I ran this GB again was because one of the 'business matters' that TTZ had to deal with from the 1st GB was the fact that the previous manufacturer mis-counted how many sets they had in stock!!! So we had sold 1 more set in the GB than we actually had!!!.......the manufacturer refused to cover for THEIR MISTAKE by making one more set!!!............but rather than make another forum member who was the last to join the GB miss out!........ I sacrificed my own personal set so they could have them!!!........& I have had to go through all this crap just to get another set for my own car!!!!.......& now you question my honesty & integrity!!!!! All you have had to do is pay a deposit & wait patiently while others work hard to organise to have a set of headers made for you AT A DISCOUNT PRICE! What have you had to do to get this benefit?? absolutely NOTHING!!!! apart from being asked to show a little PATIENCE!!!....but even this seems to be too much to ask for!!! Perhaps a little APPRECIATION for what people are doing to help benefit YOU might not go astray! & while you are it spare a thought for members like MikeB who was the first to join this 2nd round GB back in April!! .......a long time before the last stragglers such as yourself joined in! He & myself have not only had to wait for all these manufacturing issues to be sorted out but we also had to wait the extra time to get the numbers we needed to place the order in the first place!!!! ..........but it is one of the last people to join the GB that is jumping up & down & crying about it! ......not once has MikeB questioned mine or TTZ's integrity or accused us of a 'root around'!
Your doing a good job zedhed. I am, and will wait for as long as it takes. I've made a comment before without understanding what was going on. Wether or not this applies to other members I'm not sure, but I can say that the majority of us are all (hopefully) very grateful for what you are doing.
Thanks James! I understand this is frustrating for everyone! but it's ten times worse at my end! I can honestly say I'm doing all I can to make sure we ALL get a good result out of this GB!! & that no-one gets ripped off! & by no-one that includes TTZ!!! Even if everyone was to pull out of the GB now & TTZ kept the non-refundable deposits!......Simon would still personally lose a huge amount of money due to the outlay for the jigs & to pay for the work that has been done so far! Even at completion of this GB, TTZ's profit margin on these headers is minimal in order to keep the price down for us!
well said russ. I'm sure most of us appreciate what you're doing for us. To begin with i was a bit pissed off when i was uninformed, but i'm more understanding and appreciative now. Can't wait til i get my hands on a set of these
well said russ. I'm sure most of us appreciate what you're doing for us. To begin with i was a bit pissed off when i was uninformed, but i'm more understanding and appreciative now. Can't wait til i get my hands on a set of these also...how much would it take an exhaust shop etc to install a spot for the egr valve later on?
Not sure??? The EGR provision was not included as it is a HARDPIPE connection!.......so if the bung was not EXACTLY in the right place it would cause all sorts of fitting issues!! & this could only be achieved by manufacturing a prototype that could be test fitted to a real car!! .........again more cost & more importantly extra time delays!!! .......& even if it was 100% exact??......it would only take someones engine/chassis etc to have been moved slightly for some reason??......eg worn engine mounts etc........& again there would be headaches with getting the hardpipe connection to line up correctly.......so in the end it was not included?.......suggestions of developing a 'flexible' adapter were considered but again time involved & costs were the deciding factor! Best to speak to Joe Imbesi..........who I would suggest you get to fit these headers!!.......as he is the best Z mechanic in Vic plus he has fitted many of the TTZ sets before so he is more than familiar with them!! He will be able to tell you what can or can't be done & for how much??
sorry bout the multiple posts yeah i've been to joe before, he did a great job on my car i've still never actually met him though lol. When i took it up he'd just left, and i picked it up on a weekend so he wasn't there. Ah well. just got simon's email too man
I for one would like to PERSONALLY thank ZeDHeD for his efforts on this. He's taken flak that he shouldn't have had to. IMO - I'd much rather it take a little longer, and have a high quality product, than a quickly delivered, PITA to fit product that fails shortly thereafter... OK, It's taking a little longer than everyone expected, but having spoken to Simon myself (on an unrelated matter - didn't realise at first he was header supplier), I understand why the delays have been there, and the lengths Simon has gone to to make sure what we get is a top product. The different manufacturer is the cause of the delay as already stated. Having to make new jigs isn't fast nor cheap. As for Simon - he went to great lengths to help me with my recent PTU failure, and I have spoken to him a fair bit incidentally now about the headers. Nothing but good things to say fabout him rom me right now. The Upshot - Simon wants to get the headers done as much as any of us, but he wont rush it and deliver a sub-standard product. My 2.2c Incl GST
TTZ UPDATE Ok ...........you should have all received Simon's email update by now! From what he is saying he is prepared to get the first set he receives for approval (this week) HPC coated (assuming it meets the required standards)?? HPC should take about a week to complete all being well! This means someone will be able to receive a set possibly next week??.......& earlier than the rest?? I'm prepared to wait for my set as I can't get them fitted just yet anyway! But I think the fairest way to decide who gets the first set is to give it to the person who has been waiting the longest in the GB!!.......in this case MikeB!!!!!.......who has NEVER complained about the delays!!! I definitely don't think it should go to the one who jumps up & down & complains about it the most!!! Just my 2c! If anyone has GENUINE reasons as to why they need their set URGENTLY before the others then please speak up??.......otherwise they will go to MikeB! Similarly if you are not in a rush to get them & don't mind waiting just a little longer then please let me know!
Thanks Simon! I appreciate it! Like I've said before & I will say again! Simon @ TTZ is going waaaaaaaay beyond what many businesses would do to ensure us forum members get a quality product in this case!! Many others would have thought the whole process way too hard & given up a long time ago! Members like sbe who have spoken with Simon personally have realised his commitment to this! Perhaps some of you 'doubters' should also give him a call & hear what he has to say for yourselves???.......it might make you appreciate the efforts that are going on behind the scenes a little more????
I'm flat out right now, so I'm happy enough to let others go before me. No use having nice shiny headers lying around getting dusty now is there....
TTZ UPDATE - Pic Ok by now you should have all received Simon's latest update emails with pics of the first completed set that he has received for his approval?? Simon told me he has only had 2 replies from GB participants regarding who needs a set urgently??? so that means he still hasn't had a reply from 4 buyers??? ..........which is surprising considering the recent posts regarding this GB!! Here's a pic of the new set: This shows the new 'standard' finish which is now silver heat resistant paint instead of black! This set will be sent to HPC if needed before shipping to whoever wants the first set?? ......upon receipt of FULL PAYMENT (including Gaskets if required + Shipping = TBA!) The HPC sets will look like this: (this is an old set): Remember this is a CERAMIC coating that helps improve the thermal characteristics & performance of the headers! These are not a polished stainless steel finish! Can everyone please respond to Simon's email requesting info regarding how urgently you require them?? This set plus one other will be ready in the next week or so?? After that the remainder will be completed asap???.......so if you need them please speak up?? .......or even if you don't please inform TTZ!!!
Good stuff Russ,how anyone could doubt your efforts is beyond me ,maybe they should try to get a smic from james and see how they go They will be good and will certainly add improvement to any n/a :zlove:
2c worth noted and I don't have any problems with the person that was first in getting the first set, after all that is the fair thing to do.
So who wants them??? 2 sets are available soon as per Simon's latest email! 1 set will definitely be HPC & available as of 17/10! The other is due to be sent to HPC & available 24/10 ........but I believe this set could be left as a standard finish if needed??....... provided TTZ are given enough notice so they are not sent directly to HPC from the manufacturer!!!........ which would mean they could be available earlier (17/10) as HPC takes approx 1 week?? No-one has actually put their hand up to say they need their headers urgently?? .........which is strange all things considered! MikeB ..........you have been waiting the longest so if you want them please contact me to arrange final payment? DuncsZ........you requested them by the end of October?? Zedex.........you were keen to get a standard set asap?? PM's have been sent to you all!
1 set spoken for! Ok......looks like either Zedex or WesternZ will be getting one of the 2 available sets in a standard finish! so the other HPC set is still up for grabs!
ALL headers to be completed!! Hi all Simon has just issued his latest update to you all via email! The good news is that it looks like ALL the headers will now be completed by the end of next week! Those that are not having HPC will need to get their final payments to me by this time!.....so your sets can be shipped immediately! Those who are having HPC will have an extra week while the headers are being coated to get their payments finalised! I will PM everyone ASAP??? with individual FINAL PAYMENT amounts, including shipping costs!! Payment details will be as before.......but I will include them again in the PM's! Thanks!
Final Payments to TTZ!! Hi all Thanks to Optus I've had no internet access at home for the past week!! & still don't have it! Simon will be issuing you all with final invoice amounts via email & this last payment will be made DIRECTLY TO TTZ!!! so please don't deposit anything into my account!!! TTZ payment details will be provided in the email! The bonus is this means you can pay with a credit card if you want to?? Simon should have these invoices to you all soon!
