yes it is auto, there are three cables on the controller that are after a supply. one needs permanent supply. one needs supply while starting and one that is label "ignition 2" i presume the run position on the key. i am i right i will check the cables they are actually connected to in thext couple days.
yes it is auto, there are three cables on the controller that are after a supply. one needs permanent supply. one needs supply while starting and one that is label "ignition 2" i presume the run position on the key. i am i right i will check the cables they are actually connected to in thext couple days. So the open circuit is because there is a wire incorrectly connected which created a power supply to run through from the starter wire and the ignition wire via the EBC- this is the most likely scenario be it a negative or positive connection base (depends on the circuit) and likely to be positive in this case. Its possible that the starter could be connected from arcing but it is unlikely, especially given you have raised the EBC. Generally the starter doesn't work in most failures, so arcing is more unlikely at this stage. Rest is up to you to look and trace along your starter wire for the ebc wire- the wire to connect to that is wrong! Check the manufacturers specifications online - go from the circuit diagram only. Colours mean nothing in wiring! Oh - hopefully the EBC Still works - be careful with this stuff or you could get a fire (ex long time fireman advice ) Goodluck :zlove: JC
ok back at it and tested a couple of things. it has come down to the way the Gizmo ebc asks for the wiring to be done. it actually causes a loop to the starter circuit when it is on accessories. the use a relay which causes this to happen. wIt is a Gizmo ms-2, if anyone has them. it asks for the 3 connections to the relay 1 permanent supply. 2. supply while starting 3. ignition supply when in accessory position it loops through to the start terminal as well, on the relay. its all most like it is the wrong type of relay. I cant see where i am going wrong. maybe it should have a diode to stop supply looping.? help would be muchly apreciated.
Hey Its hard to understand some of the post - pics would be easier ie why would a loop be needed, even if dual function, there is no requirement to monitor amperage ? The diode should be inbuilt if required it makes more sense one of those wires is wrongly connected ! (especially if it is back feeding the current through to the starter) If I could see what you are talking about it would be easier I tried this: http://www.gizzmoelectronics.com/pdf/IBC Instruction.pdf Its all I could find and the hookup, is very simple with no loop and no starter circuit? Supply while starting is another ignition wire - not starter circuit itself per se - it can be used for memory backup with power sources that turn off / different batteries like alternative batteries used for starting and in that case would have an inbuilt power diode or at least show that on a wiring manual in that setup - as two would have an effect on voltage I get the feeling that the starter circuit should not be involved in this - would explain at least half of your problem! I mean - why would your EBC controller need to start your car? and why is the starter connect to accessories? Can you direct me to the manual on the web or post up pics? Sorry for being confused - I could help more with pics! Cheers JC
hi that manual is different to what i have, gizzmo ms-2 it is at http://gizzmousa.com/file-copies/MS_2_Manual.pdf i havent put any loops in check out the diagram in that manual and you will see what i am on about.
Technically there should be no loops, all leads should be direct source to/from the units being 12 v. The loop the manufacturer refers to is one that is in the solenoid wires and is internal and is not associated with the leads directly as such - that part can be confusing the way its worded Anyway: So the blue wire is ign 1 and should be connected to ign on - this is usually a yellow wire but must be tested (the key says on) The red wire is the memory saving wire and goes directly to the battery The yellow/green wire is not needed as stated and should be insulated, however it can go to ign 2 (this is actually before 1 on the barrel!) it is also turned on before ign 1 on the barrel as the layout of the barrel suggests. This wire should be insulated until the wiring has been setup correctly, at the least. Earth it out as shown correctly to the body/ good ground - not a wire! Connect all prewire/ relays as stated There should be no connection to an accessory or starter line involved. Check the ignition settings on the barrel, if they are jumping the solenoid and starting the car they are likely crossing incorrectly at the barrel through the ebc leads - check the lines. Be aware that the blue line is normally the primary 2 ign wire as well, so the colour suggests that the two ignition wires are reversed however this is not what the manual indicates here, so these must be tested first by a lead light and key in the barrel selection. Remember the accessory barrel contact is not the ignition 2 or ign 1 contact in the barrel! NO ACC Needed - red wire direct to bat! Remember - the odds are you have the wrong connections on the barrel with the ebc power leads (or earth) Refer to the two primary ignition wires in the Z manual if in doubt! Hope this is helping
Ok The manual says must stay on while starting, so i connected the blue wire to the start wire on the ignition. and the yellow to the run wire of the ignition. The loop is actually in the relay of the ebc, i have found. if I dont need the yellow on the ebc what would it be for do you think?? do I need to connect the FCD on the ebc? As you can tell I have never played with EBC's before.
The manual says must stay on while starting - this is referring to battery power as batteries can drain whilst starting - this means you can use an alternative supply source if you have one (2nd battery) - it does not imply that you connect to the starter! The yellow can be used on the secondary ignition contact - its virtually the same as the primary contact except it has less drain from other resources - hence why they suggest using it (its present on the Z) - but it is not essential to use - get it right first - before thinking of using this wire In simple terms this can prevent more draw on a wire that is used for lots of power elsewhere thus preventing overload - having said that - most have extra allowances being primary wires with large amperage gauge wires, so this should not be an issue in 90% of cases - regardless - deal with this wire only if you have already set it up and its working fine - then you can afford to worry about less drain on the primary ignition wire (hope this is making sense) This is why it is jumping the barrel from an incorrect loop in the leads on the EBC and starting the car - you should not be connecting to the starter circuit - think about it for a second.......... Why would you need the starter on an EBC? - Its not as if the EBC needs to start the car - it only needs to know the car is on and so only a supply is needed when on. This is why you are having problems with the starter - its looping back through the barrel and ignition is connecting the starter via the ebc wire - does this make sense yet Get rid of the starter wire and just run it to a source while it is running - i.e. just the ignition primary or alt ignition source (unless you have a second battery) The red wire is memory and goes to the battery direct Anything that has a made in chinese background is hard to understand, the device is from the UK but the circuitry is from china and as always chinese whispers come into play when converting their wiring diagrams - not just an ebc - you have to go with standard practice when considering the wiring of electronics regardless of country, except the chinese tend to skimp on unnecessary electronics like extra relays and diodes Regular practice for an EBC is - i.e. 12v leads should be direct only/ diodes will not be needed/ loops should be internal and technically all relays should be internal as well (the last part relays being not in this case - being of china origin) Yes the FDC should connect as is pictured Hope your on track now. I hope this making sense Regards JC
I was only 90% sure this was your problem before based on what was said and with some guessing The good news is that I am now 100% sure this is your problem. The ignition wires (blue/ yellow) should technically make no real difference if connected vice versa to either ign 1 or ign 2, however in some rare cases it can. In simple terms - what I am saying is that it should be checked with testing but its unlikely to make any difference and either wire connected vice versa should be fine. Cheers
yes sure is, it is the first ebc i have played with. i am now starting to understand how the work and what their requirements are. general speaking just not enough info for someone that has never played with one. the manual that is online is different than what came in the box. now i have to wrap my head around setting boost pressures, that does not seem a simple task in these. from what i see it is not just a matter of entering a pressure setting. thanks for helping out
I was looking at the boost setting program and agree, does not appear simple -It's a bit like buying a watch these days and trying to change time zones - makes sitting a flight test look easy Glad your on track Goodluck :zlove: JC
yea thought it was just me being dumb shit..... might fit a tempory manual boost controller until i have the car tune properly then use the ebc.
Not about being a dumb shit, it's just learning about something unfamiliar. Everyone has been in the same boat at one stage. I think you should persevere with it and not worry about the manual controller, yeh - you will have to read a few pages and spend an hour or so playing around (and it can be frustrating) but it will get easier once you get the first couple of settings in. (As you will find out) Soon you will be the master of all things EBC and able to help/guide others on everything to do with EBC's - I will have to come to you in future - haha I have about half a dozen trades (radio tech/ elec tech/ pc tech) behind me and 80% of people would not even attempt to wire one of these in the first place - so don't be too hard on yourself - your willing to try it and willing to learn - that's worth 80% credit just by itself! Always remember that 90% of circuitry comes from china (because its cheap) regardless of where you got the product from and chinese translation to English can be very literal in context when being converted - e.g. "too hot to touch" could end up being translated to "cool hands before and after contacted". This is how the "starter" word was included in the translation and was misleading (would throw anyone with some trade experience) - the word should not even have been used in the schematics of it and should have been actually translated to something like "power when working" instead - but that's the chinese for you - haha Happy Z boosting!
Hahaha Thanks for the vote of confidence. I to have multiple trades, probably why I am not looking at it the way I should. First trade is a body builder, not heeman stuff but coach buses and trucks etc. then along came refrigeration and then the electrician. Hence after reading all those poxy australian standards that I expect wording to be correct in instructions. Can you really test a boost controller without driving? My car has not been tuned yet after a rebuild/ mods. I have to cart the car about 400k's to a dyno and I don't really want to get there and not have the ebc working etc. what is a normal idle vacuum on the engine. I think mine is to high at around 15psi vacuum.
Yep - all our State and Federal government frameworks are passed through to psychologists before going to context in print. I did military and fire for over 20yrs each as well so I know all about reading juggernaut manuals day after day on OH&S and Standard Frameworks etc haha - Is the collar the top or the part where it folds (into a collar) in print context and is the glass half full or half empty in the schematics context. I have found a few inconsistencies in our books but the chinese translation is outrageous, sometimes dangerous and funny in comparison! We are spoilt with precise context in the English language! If the car is tuned correctly - yes you can run the boost controller properly. If the car has been modified with Injectors etc, you could have new fuel maps altogether and so it's tune could be questionable unless the work and has been carried out already. It is not essential to use a dyno for performance and tuning. Tuning can also be done with performance testing (0-100klm) reasonably accurately and in some cases old skool engine guru's have previously tuned an engine to the "sound and feel of the engine" and confirmed a good tune in both speed and/ or dyno. Unless the mods are fully known the boost setting cannot be properly determined. I personally would think it is better to progressively map the tune starting at a lower level and building up so you can do it safely - thus I would start with a lower boost level and work from there with testing and monitoring. I cannot technically answer as the mods could be larger turbo's or injectors and these alone could throw the tune significantly. One would assume that these mods would require nistune or the like and their is plenty of maps and support available! To the point you can monitor the maps for both performance and economy progressively and get maps from others with the same mods and have a reasonable tune to start and with (that was originally from a dyno - haha) this monitoring is how you can find best tunes for the applications (racing, street economy etc). At a guess - I would pull it back to 12 psi for the moment - and go from there with monitoring for detonation/ pinging etc - the value being you control it. You can get a good tune to start with on a dyno, so they are a great resource if the operator is competent (some have blown engines before .) Its a choice and not essential! Even with a dyno - tune, you should still monitor the performance and stats of the vehicle to always try to obtain a better tune - it never stops technically - that is if your an engine performance freak Cheers JC
