Feel the difference - 3" SS SuperSplit DP & 3"/2.5" SS TP

LOL, Oh, I'm quite aware of the tt.net drama. I posted this exact same thread in there. That's what zductive may be eluding to. In short, it boils down to those who have extremely strong feelings about new products coming out that closely resemble in some way or fashion something previously made by a known Z vendor. Trouble is, those people take those extreme strong feelings to the next level where it tends to get very nasty and viscious. So much so, that I almost filled a complete tt.net page with a similar thread like this all because the hardcore tt.net members couldn't stand the mention of another vendors name or how they are acrewing a customer base that's competing against their favourite vendor. Unfortunately, that whole thread was deleted (not surprised) so as to leave no trace of a newer vendors latest product. What was gained by this type of sensorship? - I'll let you decide.

 

What a retarded pile of bullshit to have to deal with. There's nothing wrong with a bit of competition.

Those look like extremely high quality parts, I dont doubt there's a nice improvement there! .5" is a fair bit, nice pics.

 

with them turbos i would not go down a size i would keep it all 3inch to make more hp

 

Seriously? "Closely" resemble?





Pick the difference.

Removing a weld does not constitute closely resembling a product rather than blatant copying.

I think JT said it best (even though I'm not sure I will be choosing SZ when it comes to downpipes, but if I don't it certainly won't be because I have chosen AMS instead)

Were you really surprised at the reaction from ttnet?

There could have been no response to the initial thread and I still would hazard it would have been deleted. Even "unsaid" threats are enough to get the back up on most people...

How long is the wait for 300 degree, urmm, I mean Alloy toyz / AMS fuel rails?

 

is that right,thats exactly what gonzo does with nearly all his stuff,yet none of you have ever said anything in his threads have you ??? a bit too close home i guess lol
how many ways can you design a fkn pipe anyway

 

It's a bit of pipe ffs. Development? I would have made it a very similar way if I had a coupla bits of pipe, a welder and a 5". There are only so many ways (like 2) to route a divorced dump down next to the z gearbox with a decent length for the wastegate pipe.

Yes, it appears to be a close "copy", but at the end of the day it's the logical way of making it fit. I wouldn't buy either of them, there's $100 in steel there...

Bit like the MSP manifolds vs the AMS manifolds (which are quite obviously different). Just bits of pipe which are restricted by space. Development, sure a little bit. Take a mold, thicken up all round, bore out the guts, make a new mold and make hundreds. I could've done it too, and a hell of a lot quicker than Mikey...

 

We havent bought any of his products either...

 

If I recall he went through and did flow bench testing on his to see if it was actually going to improve performance or not. Its all well and good to say that you could make one similar just bore it out etc but he went through the R&D of finding out if the damn thing would actually work.

 

Wow!!!! This is too funny

OK, are all of you right now looking at the pic above that zductive had copied from my pic's? And you are all now saying that they look almost identical? That the new 3" one's on the inside are AMS copies of SZ's? So therefore you believe that the ones on the outside are the SZ ones?
This is too funny.
The older ones on the outside are my Z1 5bolt Dumps that were just removed to make way for the AMS dumps.
As a few of you just mentioned, there's only so many ways to bend and join pipe to fit the Z's allocated space.
Here everyone (or most) thinking that those were side by side pics of AMS's and SZ's.
FWIW, SZ's 3" dumps have an extra section (total of 4) whereas the AMS ones have only 3. Less welds means stronger piece.
When you really get down to it, aren't most vendors copying the oem part to some degree and trying to improve upon it. Things like upper adjustable control arms, adjustable tension rods etc. Who made the first? Who's copied who? I couldn't give 2 sh*ts who. To me as a consumer, my dollar goes to value, quality and price. It always does. Well, almost, I do have a favourit Italian salad dressing. How many Italian salad dressings are there out there?
Any you guys catching my drift?
Those that have brand loyalty, I commend you. There's nothing wrong with that at all. Those vendors in some cases heavily rely on that customer base as they may not be the most pro-active to keep their product up to date with latest tech to stay competitive. They will eventually fall be the wayside in time if their business strategies don't keep up.

 

true.....but we cant compare this to gonzo as from what i know he actually got permission from the creators to buy one and copy it(refering to the widebody).......

you would be suprised that there is alot of work to go into it for someone to come along to buy them.....but hey i shouldnt be complaining as competition is what runs the economy........

but i find it extremly funny that half these guys who are against it went and said to(i forgot who now, but the guy who said he was against the idea of the HID units called upom that was a rip off of an identical proper esprom or whatever product) that they didnt know why he was complaining as everything works on copying things........just have to live with it, if not then go and buy a bloody patent to protect the copying of the product...

 

There's two pics there... One of yours, and one that I posted.

Feel free to reread the post.

Rofl. I'm sure comments about the workings of a local member would have gone done really well...

Feel free to research my posts and see how many second rate / blatant copies I have on my car or ever plan to have on my car.

Have a look at the progression of down pipes in the Z scene.

They used to be open ended.

SZ then came out with the split design based on research in the Audi community. Tuneagent / Megan racing / blah blah blah copied them. There were a few series of splits that SZ made. These splits have been around for many years and noone has thought to make the pipes EXACTLY like SZ did except obviously for SZ. How many months did it take until they were again copied. The fact it took years to come to a design like this suggests that even though there is limited space, it isn't the first design that people come to when designing for the Z.

It's a blatant copy. Just accept it already.

Go do some research on the process of obtaining a patent sufficient to protect your product. SZ is a two man company. Understand what I'm getting at?

 

If we were to make rails we would make base them on the Border Racing. But wait 300Degree (TT.Net admin) did that

We are not interested in making the rails for the time being.

Regards,

Vuk@AMS
www.amszstore.com

 

what a bunch of tools in this thread. its called competition. if you don't like AMS product then don't buy it, its pretty simple. There is no copying here. Thats like saying Toyota copied Nissan because they made a RWD 2 door twin turbo coupe, but they just changed it a little bit

you guys don't understand how stupid you are making yourselves look

I know you have defi gauges zductiv, but defi were NOT the first company to make in car electronic gauges, so you OBVIOUSLY have copied parts (going by your reasoning)

I also know you have some imported mags, and I could guarantee that company was not the first ever to make a magnesium alloy wheel, which by your reasoning means they are COPIED

you probably think i'm over-exaggerating a tad here, but by this threads standards i'm not. Its called competition, Nissan created the first - and businesses are improving that initial design.

I know that Kakimoto and Vielside make a very similar off the shelf exhaust system for the Z32 but I've never heard anyone call either a copy cat, yet the exhausts are VERY similar (just like in this case)

no need to be wankers because someone isn't doing exactly what you would do

 

Haha. I'd dissect your post and show you who looks stupid but you do it well enough for the both of us.

Rofl. Thanks for the laugh Nick

 

no thank you mate, you are the comedian around here

Rofl.

 

Now there's a good objective perspective. No mention of product preference or loyalty or finger pointing as to who copied who or when etc. Nick, I'm surprised you stopped short and didn't touch on the HID market. Does zductive have HID's? If so, what copies (by his definition) does he use? Not to be rude, but there's definitle a touch or arogance implied when it's said "see how many second rate / blatant copies I have on my car or ever plan to have on my car". I'm not an engineer so I can't and wouldn't catagorize something that's not first-run as second rate or a blatant copy. And why does it really matter to the average consumer Joe like ourselves. Is there some strick code that I'm not aware of that says "John, you can't put that on your car unless it's been officially blessed by the hard core Z enthusiasts (who have obviously lost touch with the fun factor) and if you do, heaven forbid you tell anyone because than you have fallen from grace. You are now amoung the tainted. The irreverent many who fail to see through the same eyes of those hard liners of what is acceptable and which is not. You know what? Until someone starts paying for my hobby and my parts, I'll continue to decide for myself what is acceptable for myself and my Z and wouldn't even dare to suggest or even utter to anyone what is morally ethically or Z correct. Who the heck am I to tell other's what's what? No my place or for the most part any member here. It's a platform to share a hobby,an experience, a passion and a love for car. As soon as we let other individual's morals and ethics try to dictate a wrong and a right, what's acceptable and what isn't then we've strayed from the purpose and intent of this platform called a Forum.

 

And if you had simply based your design on the SZ expansion pipes 90% of this thread wouldn't exist.

If you are trying to say the 300degree rails are a blatant copy with no R&D, or improvement I suggest you do a little reading.

http://www.twinturbo.net/net/viewmsg.aspx?forum=general&msg_id=1826079

http://www.twinturbo.net/net/viewmsg.aspx?forum=general&msg_id=1816516

http://www.twinturbo.net/net/viewmsg.aspx?forum=general&msg_id=1821114

If you can't tell the difference between what I'm talking about and what NickTT is laughably trying to make an analogy to, I'm wasting my breath (...fingers?). And no, I don't have HIDs. I wish I did but I can't afford them as yet. Nissan installed them stock before your mind begins to think "ah ha, gotcha."

I am, at least, I'm in training to be. Final year. I don't think being an engineer (or a budding one) makes any difference on categorizing something as a blatant copy or an improvement on a current design though. A trained monkey could do that (but apparently untrained developed ones are still grasping straws with the concept)

Or perhaps an indicator to my code of morality? Who knows.

/end

 

Oooops, I forgot to mention.

The other site had a post of the cost breakdown for a private company to acquire a patent. Basically, it would cost no less than $1,200.00 usd. But more along the lines of just under 2k. That said, those that continually emphasize the poor inventors woes of not being able to protect their product really doesn't really hold much water. For all of their R&D monies spent, you think they'd factor in the patent costs as well. Seems like good business management planning to me. But then again, I'm not a business owner and don't profess to be knowledgeable in that area.
Forgot to include this in previous post.

 

the bitching is so ugly

threads like this suck, but shouldn't be censored, instead, people should rise above it

how about the people that don't like AMS products, choose not to buy them, and let everyone else go about their business