Melb Dyno day fun.....(dialup nasty)

Discussion in 'Post Event Discussion' started by JEDI-77, Oct 31, 2004.

  1. JEDI-77

    JEDI-77 Jedi Master

    This saturday, lots of us melb folk went down to M1 automotive in Bulleen to hopefuly get some nice dyno figures. It was a nice warm day (perhaps not ideal for power figures), with a great turn out. As usual I was the self nominated club photographer and writeup person. Thanks to both M1 automotive for providing a professional service and to Pete (WYKKED) for organising the day. Big thanks also to Bob and Simon who provided invaluable advice and suggestions in regards to peoples car, help with tuning and data logging...:)

    Well I guess I'll start with my car first. My power curve is now looking a hell of a lot healthier than my last dyno graph, with no zig zags or wierd bumps. The max power for the weekend for me was 138.2rwkw. The airfuel ratio is also very good, it could probably run a little leaner to sqeeze out more power but I dont mind erring on the side of safety especially with summer coming up. Interestingly, it seems like the heat was able to knock off a few kw's cos as the temp went up, the power went down, down to about 134rwkw. I also have a screwed O2 sensor which seems to affect my power, so thats another thing to get fixed...:( I was hoping some of the other NA's on the day got a torque graph as well because I would be interested to see how much torque I am making in comparison to them. I seem to have a max torque (Nm) of about 246. Is that good??? also, like power, is that at the wheels or is calculated back to the flywheel?? Anyway, enough with me....


    Here are just some other pics of the day....

    Simon getting some runs....

    A diverse range of front bars on the day..

    This is Hoemans car. Engine built by nissport and still undergoing tuning improvements. I hope ryan doesnt mind me saying his figure. On the day this car had 310rwkw. And it can go much higher than that...:)

    Cletus and his unique zed.....

    Jacks (zxtt-1) newly rebuilt engine. I think he was more than happy with his 250rwkw figure. Am I remembering this correctly jack??

    This car is a freak..:) This is dougs car (red32). Its supposedly meant to have a very sick engine and yet pulled the 2nd highest figure for the NA's peaking at 127rwkw. And all its got is airfilter and exhaust mods! I would have your engine tested again doug, maybe its not as sick as you think..:) Unless all the carbon deposits is upping the compression or taking the targa's off adds an extra few killowats.....:LOL::LOL:

    Max's car. It pulled a healthy 212rwkw and boy did he remind me about it alllll afternoon.....:)

    The trusty jedi mobile....

    Hmmmm, i like this paint job..... but i cant remember what the power figure was...

    Another trusty NA....
    For those with NA's, there were some good comparisons on the day. The average power range for the NA's with exhaust and airfilter mods was 120-127rwkw. There were 2 fairly stock NA's. Robs car is stock except for a unifilter, and his engine has been rebuilt. He got 110rwkw. Grants car which is also stock, except for exhaust pulled a 114rwkw. Also, after some testing on the dyno, it seems that a non-functioning det sensor or a code 34 will knock of approx 10rwkw.

    Robs rebuilt NA...



    Blipmans car on the dyno getting some very nice figures. I think he got a 260rwkw figure. But he says he's bored with it so I think he doesnt deserve it. Wanna give me a spare 100rwkw??

    Just some random pics from the day....







    The good thing about this dyno place is that its right next to a health and fitness centre. That means, lots of nice young girls entering and leaving the gym. Can anyone guess what these guys were looking at??

    In the afternoon, some guys in their noisy, bee sounding mazda's turned up. Of course, seeing all the zeds out the front they had to show us just how powerful their cars were....


    Some other cars turned up on the day as well....
    There was a stock VR 5 litre V8 calais which got a peak figure of something like 132rwkw. But it was odd because it started at like low 120's, then managed to hit the 130's, and then after that it struggled to get above about 125rwkw. Wierd.

    Max's friend also bought his VN SS along, which got a respectable 152rwkw's. Not sure of the mods but I think it has exhaust mods and a chipped ECU?? Is this right max?? And why do the holden guys run their cars on the dyno with their airfilter disconnected?? As far as I could tell, both of them had pulled the pipe joining their airfilter to the throttle body, so the air was just flowing straight into the throttle body?? Is this cheating??? :LOL::LOL:. Max has lots of friends, and his other friend with an r33 Gts-t got a nice 176rwkw.

    Twas a fantastic day with the usual mix of dissapointment (bullshit, she can do better than that), confusion (wow, I didnt know that sensor wasnt working) and excitement (F%$K, I have that much power!). I highly reccomend the services provided by M1 automotive. They are great bunch of guys and very experienced. They managed to squeeze something like another 80rwkw's out of Haydens car by installing and tuning a Unichip. I'm sure he'll have more details about that. There were heaps of dyno runs and I cant remember them all. Maybe some of the others members will post them...:)
  2. JETzx


    looks like fun day, but why does that rx3 have red tires?lol
  3. red32

    red32 You talkin' to me?

    Good write-up, Mark. Arthur (from M1) made an interesting observation

    Because my car is an AusDel, it doesn't have the power button which locks in third gear on the Auto. So my power run was made in second gear, which is an indirect ratio. He reckons this costs about 30kW, which then puts my output up to about the mid-150's. Can anyone here explain how this could be... I thought that the engine made power independantly of the gear it is recorded in. He got the computer to do a calculation and came up with 156kW at the wheels. Not bad for an NA engine with compression ratios between 125 and 150.
    Go figure!

    Very happy!

    Edit: Should see the dent in the concrete floor where Jack's jaw hit after his first run showed 239kW. He said before-hand he was expecting about 200
  4. JEDI-77

    JEDI-77 Jedi Master

    wow man, if your car is making 156rwkw at the wheels.....

    I'm gonna strip down naked and walk down chapel street. Either that, or I'm putting my engine into your car and taking yours..:)Hmmmmm, as a comparison, massivechicken, on the same dyno, 1 year ago pulled a 135rwkw. And besides me and a few others, he probably has (had, he sold it silly boy) the most modded NA on the forum. That thing was a killer as some of the melb TT owners can attest too.... so yeah, 156rwkw??? I think there's something odd going with the whole auto and dyno thing and how it calculates the value..... You sure when arthur said that it costs you 30kw that it wasnt the other way?? ie, 127rwkw - 30 = approx 100rwkw??... Either way man, full respect to your zed.....

  5. JEDI-77

    JEDI-77 Jedi Master

    cos he's a mazda-bater??? sorry, sad joke...
  6. red32

    red32 You talkin' to me?

    Like I said,

    Arthur definately said running in second would reduce the power on the dyno (BTW ProTek recorded it at 145 after the exhaust was fitted, but they managed (somehow) to keep it in third). I asked Arthur if the figure produced by an auto was at the flywheel, and he replied that all chassis dynos give rear wheel figures.

    Note: The "TT" bit is wrong
  7. BigCol

    BigCol That's what she said...

    Yes, Jack's face was classic!

    As for your figures, Rob (110rwkw), Grant (114rwkw) & myself (118.7 on the same dyno a year ago) all have Aus Specs. My auto box & possibly Grant's have been rebuilt but still don't have lockout functionality so I'm not sure if this assists or detracts from your theory!

    Maybe your car has got some of the extra mojo that appears to be missing from the Jedi-mobile!
  8. JEDI-77

    JEDI-77 Jedi Master

    he stole my mmoooojooooo!

    Yeah, dyno's confuse me. I know it should be straight forward, but I dont understand the figures they produce sometimes..:) Like I said, massivechickens NA was a beast and would beat many NA's here, including my own. And yet, its 135rwkw. Beats me. Another example is Trayn's who I think had 137rwkw and produced heaps of great times on both circuit and drag strip. I'm intersted to see what the torque figures for all these cars are. I just think squeezing juice out of the NA is a lot harder than a TT, and mods will only give a small increase in Kw's when compared to the TT beast. Well, my next mod may be an underdrive pulley to get me into the 140's. Also, I'm running stock timing so I could advance that a little, but I'm not too keen doing that because the Hitec chip already has advanced timing. As for dougs power figure, I really dont know. I mean, robs car is fully rebuilt and running a pod filter and he got 110rwkw?? doug has pod filter + exhaust, and supposedly sick engine and may have 156rwkw??? doug if you're reading this, i'm telling ya buddy, get that compression checked again.

  9. Blipman

    Blipman Beer hooves totally work

    For interest's sake

    my first run did 253rwkW, running a little rich. Removed fuel with Consult (10% correction) and power went up to 260.1rwkW with 12.0 A/F ratio (although the car was getting warmer now). Upped the correction to 15% and it did 262.7rwkW with a 12.5 A/F ration. For 2rwkW I'm happy to go with the safer ratio. Then did a run in it's original state again and did 246rwkW.... shows how it was starting to get heat soaked.
    Also, for the haters out there, my car has approximately 25rwkW more with the Hitec chip than it did at similar boost levels with the original Japanese custom tune with no other changes.

    BTW, refer to your power figures in just plain Watts, 262,700rwW sounds so much better :)

  10. Bellenium

    Bellenium New Member

    Here are the details Jedi!

    Yes my zed had just under 80rwkw extracted on friday. The zed had just over 160rwkw initially and after a unichip installation, gfb controller and hours of tuning from Arthur it pulled 238.7 rwkw at 15psi! (Sorry guys but I dont have access to a scanner for the printout but other members will attest to seeing it) My modifications only include a unifilter and HKS 2.5" exhaust. I was surprised as some of the members there on saturday! I admit the zed was running very poorly before this operation and a chunk of those gains may have been made with just a decent tune but 80kw is something different! Appartently it loved a change in timing.
    The unichip in my opinion is a least if not better as good as it's other chip and ecu's competitors! It has become fairly obvious to me that real time dyno tuning makes a huge differnce as all cars are different and need individual tuning. I cant tell you how happy i am with the car and how it feels like a different car on the road. The car feels smoother with power throughout acceleration and a instant positive feel under the foot. (I found this out lurching sideways around the first corner!)

    Last of all i would like to thank Arthur at M1 Automotive for looking after me and staying up till 2am in the morning tuning the car for readiness on saturday! Also like to thank Peter, simon and bob for there help on the day!

  11. HoeMan

    HoeMan New Member

    It was a fun day.

    I wasnt sure who was who but Max introduced me to a few people. It's nice to meet everyone in person. Spoke to Jedi-77, Stanny28 and RZM for the first time.
    Yeh unfortunately I had some detonation issues on saturday between the 5-5.5rpm range. This was not an issue earlier that week so it was pretty surprising. Still, very content with my figures and I probably dont want anymore. This is where my obsession ends.
    Anyway it was great putting faces to names and I hope to be at Mark's tech day to meet more of u guys.

    Oh and well done on the write-up Mark, great pics.

  12. MaxsZX

    MaxsZX Active Member

    What a Brilliant day :thumbsup: I have 212 reasons to be very happy......

    with my car. The actual reading was 212.4rwKW. It was much to my surprise as i was expecting around 180.

    Thanks to Pete in the morning for installing some boost jets in my car (you will not be getting those back, sorry:LOL:). The jets, i think they were 1.1mm gave an increase to 12.5psi, which is what i wanted on the stock ECU :thumbsup:

    It was great seeing everyone again with some new faces to match the old faces. A great turnout i believe. Mark, like always fantastic photos and a write-up to match, lucky i fed you well:p

    My mates (George and Ernie) had fun aswell, i think they got sick of seeing toooo many zeds:zlove:
    But i was happy to beat them, Ernie's skyline got 177.6rwKW and George's VN SS got 152.5rwKW.

    I was very impressed with Ryans car producing 310rwKW with more fine tuning too come.

    What can i say about the NA Boyz........better keep quiet on this one:cool:
    looking forward to the next meeting at the JEDI-77 tech day:)


    P.S. Mark Mazda-Bater......:wacko:

    UNIQUE ZED Zed Racing World

    Looks like some nice zeds

    Lots of good pics of the cars.
    What turbo's etc on the 310rwkw car?
    JEDI-77 wondering how the air temp is 25 and inlet temp only 14, were they taking the time to put the wire type sensor actually in the intake pipe, as in losening the hose clamp on one of the throttle bodies and inserting then reclamping? As it should be much more than ambient temp? Did they have a weather station and put these in? Your power is good and may have actually been more with correct set up of dyno.
    Also did anyone actually do a before and after with any chips?
  14. Baroo

    Baroo TIMMAY!

    Mark, why do you think my car wasn't sighted?

    Dad put a hairdryer or two in that NA to get the high figures. Also his car saw my "2000" bar and got excited so behaved on the day in the hope it will get one.
  15. JEDI-77

    JEDI-77 Jedi Master


    to be honest, I'm a little confused about the whole inlet and ambient temp thing too...:) I'm not sure where the sensor was located, next time I'll take more notice. But arthur (the guy running the dyno) was very helpful and informative and I will use his services again in the future. But your right, next time I'll ask about the temp stuff. Maybe someone who was there has more info on this?? anyone?? As for the chip comparison, you wont like this, but we just didnt have time on the day. I left at about 6:00pm and there was still a car on the dyno being run. I will say this though. A few of the TT guys like Blipman and zxtt-1 who had figures in the 250's+ were running a hitec chip and so was my car which was the highest NA there. I dont want to start the whole hitec Vs other computer debate, but lots of us melb folk are happy with the hitec product.

  16. JEDI-77

    JEDI-77 Jedi Master

    On the contrary TT boy.....

    I think the NA figures were quite respectable considering the level of mods that the cars had..:) I just think you need more pizza boxes thrown in your car..:) hey did you find the secret one I stashed in your car somewhere??

  17. method

    method Active Member

    He does place the probe inside the intake, he did this when I ran

    my car there. If you know a little about it, putting it in the wrong place can vary results up to 30% which is almost 60rwkw on a TT with usual mods. I have seen people place the probe just on the airfilter etc at some places which i think is a no-no. It is so easy to do a dodgy dyno run and have no one notice it but from all the dyno's i have seen at MI Auto, they have all been accurate and Arthur always has the time to explain things to you. I learn't a lot about using the NOS in my car when i took it there to run it on the dyno with the 50shot. Arthur explains things very well and I would be confident to tell anyone to go there for major work.
  18. Fleet

    Fleet Speed Racer

    good write up and congrats to Hoeman's 310RWKW :thumbsup:
  19. red32

    red32 You talkin' to me?

    I did not...

    Snails only slow you down ;)

    And I'm not gonna fit a 2000 bar... pretty soon mine will be the only "original" looking Zed in Melbourne.

    Also, went back to MI this morning (Monday) to speak to Arthur. The Saturday figures only raised more questions than they answered. He did ALL the Aussie autos in second because of the kick-down problem - apparently this is "standard" procedure for autos lacking a lock on their direct-drive gear, be it Zed or Falcodore - so there is a direct comparison between them. The only variations will be because of differing drive-train losses from car-to-car. Robs figure (110) may be low because the engine may still be tight. He agrees that a check compression test would be useful in case the previous one was improperly done. I'll let you know next weekend at Jedi's how it goes.
    The torque figures would be interesting, as you say, Mark. If I understand it correctly, higher torque would give you better acceleration, either on the dragstrip, or out of corners on a circuit, the absolute power only really coming into the equation at the top end ie high speed.

  20. JEDI-77

    JEDI-77 Jedi Master

    Yeah I agree doug.....

    thats why I'm curious to see some NA torque figures. as for robs car, yeah I dont know. I actually dont think that a 110-115 is low for a stock NA zed. I'd say its normal, but I could be wrong. I remember some old posts where some NA owners were getting under 110rwkw's. Pah who knows... See you saturday...


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