For Sale guidelines

I hate to interrupt a serious discussion >>>

with a jovial comment - but after Tereza's last post, can anyone with photoshop transfer Tereza's curls onto Wykked's head????

Now the serious part - the act of "bumping" threads to the top of a queue simply by entering a "bump" post is something that is frowned upon by most classified type forums. I hope we run by the same principle. However, entering a comment to simply keep a thread alive is almost, but not quite, the same thing.

Where I think some problems MAY occur is when classified threads reach a point that they are older than the forum age default, they will NOT show, regardless of whether there have been posts or not. It will require users to change their own defaults, or actively change the default at the bottom of the page "just in case" something worthwhile or relevant has been added. For example, an item posted for sale at $500 35 days ago may have had some responses, but not sold. Simply adding a post to reduce the price to $300 will not render the post visible UNLESS users set their defaults to 60 days. Target audiences for the price change may not see it.

IF it were possible to have a different age default for the different sections, and IF a system of deleting all posts inactive after 2 months is applied, THEN I would like to see the forum have an age default of 60 days on the classified section, so that all new posts on ads up to 60 days old can be seen by everyone, except those that actively don't wish to.

I do grant you that the inroduction of bookmarking and personal messaging could reduce these issues - I think they are great improvements to the forum.

 

Hey Tereza

Sorry if I was misleading, nothing is set in stone which is why I'm asking people for feedback, this includes people such as yourself who will be affected by this. The matter of mentioning a if someone is a business I personally don't think is a greatly important one.... I don't know if people really care that much and I don't think it will alter the way in which businesses are permitted to post. I personally hate forums where businesses have to pay to be allowed to post... doesn't sit right with me.

Ben

 

I am all in favour of people being provided>

with as much info as possible, when contemplating a purchase, however, I don't believe that discussion/arguement about the pro's & con's of an item offered on either the For Sale, or the Group Buy forums, should take place within those ads.
Such discussion/debate should be confined to the Z Related/Non Z Related areas IMHO.
It is all too easy to "torpedo" someone's attempt to sell an item in "good faith", by starting a supposedly "I'm just trying to help" post.
If there is reason enough for genuine concern, then the message should be where it will be viewed by the greatest number of readers. That IS NOT in the For Sale/Group Buy area.

 

I disagree.....>>

Any discussion of an item placed for sale (either for or against that item) should belong in the thread that the item for sale is. We can't have people posting threads all over the plece when there is a perfectly logical place for them to be.

Wouldn't the best place to put it be in the actual sale thread, where people who are contemplating buying the item are assured of seeing it? If a group buy runs for two weeks and a post asking a question about it was placed in the NZR forum on the first day it was listed then there is a good chance that a member logging on two weeks later may never see or read the thread in NZR, but if they click on the group buy section and are interested in purchasing the product then they should be able to see all discussion that took place on the product. They shouldn't have to chase it accross all forums.

 

So I take it that you're in favour of>

allowing people to carry-out deliberate attempts to undermine someone else's GB's or For Sale ads, whenever the mood takes them?:thumbsdown:

I don't think you have given this issue sufficient thought, Pete. I know your heart is in the right place, but I believe you're wrong in this instance.

 

That isn't what I said.....>>

Where do you see me saying that deliberatly attacking an item for sale is OK? Personally I don't believe that to be acceptable, but I do believe that people have the right to ask questions, or raise concerns and the correct place to do that is in the thread in which the item is for sale.

 

This is what I have difficulty understanding>

As can be seen in the above quote, you were echoing my thoughts, earlier in this thread.

If that is your opinion, how am I to fit that into your latest remarks.

 

I agree with wykked

its seems senseless to put the posts about a product for sale into another forum altogether. They arent paid advertisements so the pros and cons, and especially any safety concerns (the most important) should be addressed. If someone sold something obviously dodgy like some crap brakes or old tyres or something along the lines that caused an accident then the person would be rightfully peeved if he finds the warning was on page 5 on the NZR section and he didnt know any better.

Being an open forum if there are any concerns about the product then the seller can put those publicly to rest and people who have actually bought the product can give their reviews and promote more sales. If the product is good then people will make up their own minds. I think the "dont comment" part just refers to pointless comments rather than directed.

 

It was not my intention to re-open old wounds,>

however, it seems I must use my personal experience as an example.
I offered an item as a Group Buy. There were no questions or suspicions that the item "was dodgy', "dangerous" or "did not perform the function for which it was intended". This did not stop several individuals from posting remarks aimed at re-directing intending buyers to alternate providers, resulting in many intending purchasers deciding to "pull-out", after the items were "in production", and leaving me seriously disadvantaged, financially.
As a result, I have decided against ever again getting involved in a GB on this site.

With regard "obviously crappy or dangerous" goods being offered, surely this would also be obvious to the intending purchaser (not just to the "Robin Hood" who feels obliged to post a warning), or is this ability to "see the obvious", a God-given gift, bestowed on a select few?

 

I still stand by that statement.....>>

Pointless, useless or derogatory comments should not be made and for that reason I still hold that there needs to be some sort of rule to prevent them. That should not stop people from asking questions or raising concerns as I believe that we all watchout for one another in this little community. And I still stand by the statement that the correct place for such comments, questions and concerns is in the original sale thread.

Accuse me of trying to have my cake and eat it too, but there needs to be a place for both.

 

That's all I'm asking for too, Pete.

So we're both on the same side.:thumbsup:

 

Businesses and Auctions

In my opinion, the definition of a business is simple. If the item was purchased with the intent of resale for profit, that's a business.
If I buy a half-cut and advertise the bits, that's a business. If I write off my Z and sell the remaining bits to recover some money, that's not. If I buy a half-cut to get a spare engine, but sell the rest of the bits, that's still a business, because I had the intent of reselling when I bought it although I'd consider some lattitude because it's a one-off.
The question about businesses is - How does it need to be declared. Logo's are fine for the regulars. If it's a one-off, a simple statement of the background situation would be fine.

Auctions are out. I think that's decided. Stopping them could be more difficult. I think the easiest way is to limit the forum to requests for more information or comments about the item (Yes Chilli, I believe we should reserve the right to make negative comments about items offered for sale).
Any offers to buy should be made through PM's. Definately, no offering an amount on the public forum. In that way, the auction situation will never arise.

Just some thoughts. See Ya,
Garry

 

Negative comment.

Hi Garry,

I agree with your general veiws on what does, or doesn't constitute a business sale, but I have to disagree on the matter of "adverse/negative comments".
Unfortunately, there seems to be an increasing number of vexatious posts, creeping onto this forum, posts containing comments which cannot be authenticated by the reader. It has become all too easy to do deliberate damage to other members posts/reputations/intentions, and for the most part, these actions are very difficult (if not impossible) to refute. For that reason, and that reason only, I continue to believe there is a need to restrict such comments from For Sale/Group Buy forums.
Those forums should not be allowed to degenerate into the sort of "he said/she said" muck-raking brawls that are becoming all too frequent elsewhere on this site, IMHO.

Cheers mate.

 

A business is determined by the fact >>

that is your main means of income or livelihood.
I would like to think that some business owners, could advertise in, say Group Buys.
But when its a genuine Group Buy for a particular item & is beneficial to the members as a whole.
What I would object to, is a business putting in a business web site of their products under the guise of A Group Buy for a single item. In that instance, if you are a business, we should have a section titled for businesses, where a member can visit to see what is available if he/she is after a specific item, similar to the "LINKS" that were on the old site.
What about Recommended Businesses, (ie: Mechanics, Auto-electricans, etc.) This I think is sadly missed & would help new members as well.
I agree with the idea of advertising that an item is to be auctioned, BUT, only as a link to, say E-Bay.
All to often, someone will be disappointed, when the part that they thought they were going to get, is sold off to someone else who bid higher than that advertised. In simple terms "NO GASUMPING", making a deal & then selling to someone who offered more for an item/s.
Cheers all
Kerry
:zlove:

 

what if I own 2 businesses and the one that

is my main means of income has nothing to do with Zeds so that means my other business that sells zed parts is not a business under your definition

I personally think NO business should be allowed to place items up for sale or auction. They have their own website for that. Also, if someone is found to be selling parts on behalf of a business then they should be banned from the forum for life.

If a business has a group buy going then they get to post in the group buy.

Group buys should indicate if the organiser is making a profit. I was pissed off to find that something I've bought in a group buy was sold at a decent profit to fund their own parts. I don't think that is in the spirit of a group buy.

 

Negative Comments

We need to have an open forum where anyone can express their views. In an extreme situation, suppose you see someone advertising their Z for sale. It's gets a great write-up, but you know it is a front and rear cut shunted together, dodgey work, maybe turbo's on the way out. Should the guidelines forbid you from warning others. Sure it's not fair for the seller but I couldn't sit back and let other members be ripped-off.
The seller has the opportunity to respond and refute any comments made about their item.
Just my opinion.
See Ya,
Garry

PS Opinions are like armpits - everyone has a couple and most of them stink.

 

I agree!! A forum is exactly that, a forum.

It's a place for discussion, whether irrelevant, untrouthful, opinionated, biased, or otherwise. If you took everybodys opinion or suggestion as the out and out truth, you'd prolly be a long way off base. The idea is to give everyone the ability to comment on anything. Buyer beware, Seller beware, advice-giver beware and don't believe all that you read.

I think I need some deoderant

 

:unsure::LOL:

I'd heard that, but didn't know whether to believe it!:unsure::LOL:

 

I can see a danger of this site being taken over by the for sale section

if businesses are allowed to do too much advertising on it. We are after all a community of people sharing a common interest (or love) Advertising invades so much of our day to day lives, please don't have it include the Z site as well.

 

Don't worry.......>>

The buisnesses that currently log onto the forum have been respectful enough to not abuse the Classified section. If it ever looked like they were it would be stopped.