Reco'd clutch MC super stiff - pedal feel keeps changing

Discussion in 'Technical' started by Mgatrn, Oct 14, 2011.

  1. Mgatrn

    Mgatrn Member

    So the pivot post broke and the MC died and I had it replaced, only now I can't get the damn pedal to feel same as before.

    Goes in and out of gears fine.
    But when cold the clutch is low and light, when hot the clutch is high and heavy (as in rock hard - no free play).

    Been on my back about 10 times adjusting the pedal, I get it perfect only to have it change 5 mins down the road.

    Took it back to the ;)shop (won't name them here), to bleed it again as I thought there could still be air in the system.
    They only bled the MC and the front nipple, they told me the slave didn't need it...but I'm not so sure.

    Any suggestions?
    I'm thinking about getting a new MC from Coz and having done with it.
    No way to rely on reco'd MC's.


    Thanks
     
  2. Sanouske

    Sanouske Retired Moderator

    What brand of MC was put in its place.

    You said it was reco'd in the title, but than you say it was replaced in the thread. Which was it?

    If they recod it, what size sleeve did they use?

    Also i would eye ball the slave, as now the new mc is in place the fluid pressure would be higher than the worn unit. At which the slaves can play funny buggers too as they too are worn the same amount as the stuffed mc. If you cant get it to feel right, and is loose than stiff. You have air still in the system, or simply the slave isnt operating correctly. So either replace the seal in the slave and try again, or replace the slave entirely.
     
  3. Sanouske

    Sanouske Retired Moderator

    Also a proper reco is just about as good as a new mc anyways. Prodiving the bore wasnt scored and scratched, a reco seal kit does the trick. Or if a new sleeve insert was put in, it would/should be just as good as new.
     
  4. Mgatrn

    Mgatrn Member

    They sleeve OEM MC's with stainless...so it's the OEM MC, honed, and with a stainless sleeve insert...or insert then honed.

    Would it be pedal adjustment? Maybe it's still too far in.
    What is the margin of error.

    Damn, it was perfect before I took it there.
     
  5. Sanouske

    Sanouske Retired Moderator

    They bore, sleeve hone. Well that's the last time i saw one done. But anyways. If you removed the mc you would probably recall how far on the adjustment rod the pedal throw was. Keeping that in mind deduct maybe 20% more and test it out. This wildly guessing would counteract the added pressure the new refurbished mc would incur.

    Realistically too much pressure and the throw out bearing will bottom out on the clutch plate. Too little and the clutch won't disengage and selecting gears will be a dog.

    I would just setup the mc the same as you would expect it to be. Than work from there. As I said earlier check out the slave. Also the rubber flexi line. Age can allow these to swell under pressure. And air. Just keep bleeding. Do you still have the bleed point on the wheel arch.
     
  6. tassuperkart

    tassuperkart Its a lie I tell you!

    The recoed MC is a far better and loger lasting item than stock. Simple as that.
    MC's are not rocket science. The comprise of a cylinder, a piston, a spring and a seal.
    Bottom line is, they work, OR they work and leak. The only time they will give dramas (apart from being worn out) is if the piston seal is split or the seal edge damaged on assembly which will result in a slowly sinking pedal if its held gently down or the clutch can slowly engage itself even with the pedal pushed hard down.

    If you are happy with the current pedal "height" Like how it sits with your foot OFF the pedal, then disconnect your linkage clevis from the pedal and MAKE SURE that the MC lingage is fully extended out with the pedal pulled back against its backstop.
    If not, adjust the clevis IN to allow some freeplay of the pedal aganst its backstop with the clevis attached.
    Or a less elegant approach is to adjust the pedal backstop to bring the pedal higher.

    If the linkage is slightly pushed in when the pedal is against its backstop, Ie the linkage is too long, then its possible the recouperating port in the MC is covered and not venting residual line pressure back in to the reservior.

    This holds the slave cylinder against the release arm and the pressure can increase due to expansion as the system heats up.
    The slave piston is not free "self adjust" allowing for clutch wear, fluid expansion due to het blah, to sit lightly against the release arm and all sorts of funny feeling pedlas can result.

    Under that infernal footwell you go again!

    L8r
    E
     
  7. Mgatrn

    Mgatrn Member

    Yeah, I'm sus on the MC cos it was the 2nd one they fitted...the first reco'd one was also faulty. We bled it extensively last night from the top and the bottom, it returns to perfect only to go hard again down the road. Fluid levels look ok, no leaking.

    All things being equal the adjustments/bleeding should have corrected the problem...since they didn't then all things cannot be equal, and my money's on the MC.

    A few more plays under there before I hand over more $$ for a brand new MC.
     
  8. tassuperkart

    tassuperkart Its a lie I tell you!

    Are you SURE that the peadl is not riding the MC?
    Sounds to me the same drama has afflicted both installs and its not being seen.
    Symptoms you describe fit a recouperating issue perfectly.

    L8r
    E
     
  9. Mgatrn

    Mgatrn Member

    What do you mean riding the MC?
    If I adjust it out any further it won't throw clutch far enough to get into gear when cold.
     
  10. tassuperkart

    tassuperkart Its a lie I tell you!

    There is a fundamental setup problem there M8.
    L8r
    E
     

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